The Things They Carried Discussion Questions: Set 1

[Mrs. C]

Welcome Everyone!

Read the following carefully.

You are about to embark on your first online discussion for this course, so please make sure you review the handout for Online Etiquette that is part of your summer assignment packet before engaging in discourse with your peers.

The first set of discussion questions is below, and I will post sets of five questions every week; there will be a total of fifteen questions for each novel. Do not feel as though you need to respond to every question, but do not focus all your responses on just a few questions; spread them out. Also, feel free to respond more than ten times.

**Make sure you read all student responses to the question you are responding to. You can respond to the question or to a student in particular--maybe you would like to address a point he or she has made. Use the "Reply to This" tag found at the bottom of each question and student response, and make sure you click on the right one for the particular question or student response you would like to reply to.

Make sure each posting is a suitable length, not too long and not too short. Each of your responses should be approximately five sentences long.

Let the discussion begin!

Sincerely, Mrs. Cohen

[Monique M.]

2. In "On The Rainy River," we learn the 21-year-old O'Brien's theory of courage: "Courage, I seemed to think, comes to us in finite quantities, like an inheritance, and by being frugal and stashing it away and letting it earn interest, we steadily increase our moral capital in preparation for that day when the account must be drawn down. It was a comforting theory." What might the 43-year-old O'Brien's theory of courage be?

I think O'Brien is trying to say that courage is a limited characteristic. It is something that we obtain more of through experiences we encounter. In this novel, O'Brien experiences horrible situations during his time at war and through these experiences he gains more courage and becomes a better leader for his men. This quote shows his courage to come back and face war itself, rather than fleeing to Canada he had to pull from his pre-existing courage in order to do what he thought would be the right thing, in other peoples' eyes. Because this quote is in the beginning of the novel, it foreshadows the hardships he will go through in war and what he will gain from his war experiences. He believes that he will become a better person because he will have more inner-courage to pull from.

[Cullen M.]

Personally, I disagree with Monique because I think that O'Brien is using this "theory" to act as an excuse for why he hadn't shown courage more often. He sees it as "finite" where as I view courage as an renewable resource maintained by an individual that should be utilized as often as possible. He says that he is "frugal" in his use of courage but I am convinced that O'Brien is simply trying to come up with an explanation for why he had not shown courage regularly. In "stashing" his courage so that one day it can be "drawn" from, he is comforting himself and avoiding the thought that he will most likely end up forever "stashing" his courage so that he will never actually be forced to make use of it. He describes it as "inheritance" because he doesn't know where it comes from. He believes it should be almost given freely to him, where as I believe courage must be worked for and earned through the acknowledgment of your fears. However I do think that inside he recognizes that his theory is a charade because he begins to understand that it was solely for his own comfort.

[Patrick B.]

I agree with Monique on the idea that O'Brien beleives courage is limited. He claims that "it comes to us in finite quantities." He also beleives that we stash away our courage in preparation for a time when we may need it. Throughout the war there are many times when O'Brien must "draw down" his courage, however i don't beleive that entering the war was one of those times. By entering the war he went against his own beleifs in order to do what is expected of him. I think that the true act of courage would have been for him to flee to Canada and stand by what he beleived in.

[Carly R]

I disagree with Cullen's statement that O'Brien used his definition for courage as an excuse. I think that for where he was, courage was prevalent every day, waking up in the morning not knowing if you'll make it to see the next. Yes, maybe there were times when O'Brien could have shown more courage, but one can't forget that he was in a war. I do agree, however, that O'Brien expected this courage to come from "inheritance" and be almost given to him, when courage is something that should be sought after and worked for. I believe there is a part in every person that always has a "stash" of courage, where we can channel inside ourselves in times of need. This "reserve" was in such constant use in the time that 21-year-old O'Brien was thinking of his own definition, that his ideas were somewhat skewed. As a 43-year-old, I believe O'Brien would realize that it wasn't always there for him and that he would have to work to get the courage to do the things he wanted to do.

[Noel D]

I agree with Carly, after having experienced the war in Vietnam I think that O'Brien would know that courage doesn't just accumulate without a reason. I think courage comes from experience harsh situations. In the war O'Brien had to wake up everyday not knowing if he would survive, it was this environment that gave him courage. If he would have been in a different environment where he was not in danger he would not have learned to deal with life threatening situations.

[Ian H]

I agree with my good buddy Cullen in that the O'Brien uses this theory as an excuse. To me courage also seems like something that is built upon and constantly practiced. On the other hand I do see where O'Brien is coming from because in war courage is usually the opposite of survival. You could be courageous in every instance, but this would lead to a much shorter existence. Perhaps O'Brien is saying if you want to live save your courage for when it is most needed.

[Kate D]

I completely agree with Cullen's description of courage. I believe it does have to be worked for, it grows through experiences, and it can be drawn from endlessly in times of need as long as the user acknowledges his fears and attempts to face them. I also agree that O'Brien's theory fits as an excuse for his lack of courage, but I don't think that he was consciously coming up with the excuse. I think he was just trying to explain this abstract idea, and being young and consumed with the goings on of war, this theory felt like it fit. I think that 43 year old O'Brien's opinion of courage would have changed from his 21 year old theory. He would have learned that courage is a quality that is built upon and worked for, and is drawn from more by acts of impulse when in times of need, than a decision to use some saved up courage when the time is right.

[Haley P]

As a 21-year-old, O'Brien illustrates courage as a simple thing to find anytime it is needed. However, I believe that 43-year-old O'Brien would disagree. It is easy to say that we will be able to step up and be courageous when necessary. When O'Brien was finally faced with evil that was "evil enough," I believe he learned that having courage is easier said than done; a theory he might believe, after such experiences, is that we must work up the courage, like Cullen said, by facing our fears. Additionally, O'Brien's experiences teach us that courage is necessary for more than just fighting "evil." Courage is needed to look beyond your opinions and personal needs, to fulfill what you must do for a greater cause. Finally, with all things considered, O'Brien may believe that courage is not always the best motivation; in the end, we face our difficulties because we are simply too afraid of what may happen if we don't.

[Alexander N]

2. I believe that O'Brien as a 43-year-old would consider courage to be standing up for what one believes in, like Patrick said, despite the opinions of others. He would consider bravery to be the courage to make decisions without society's influence. As O'Brien says in "On the Rainy River" about his past decision to not flee to Canada when faced with the choice, "I would go to the war - I would kill and maybe die - because I was embarrassed not to...I survived, but it's not a happy ending. I was a coward. I went to the war." The 25-year old O'Brien may have considered going to the war to be a courageous act, defending one's country at great personal risk. On the other hand, the older O'Brien now considers his past decision to go to the war to be an act of cowardice, as by the time he was faced with the choice, he was no longer afraid of the possibility of dying in the war if he went. Instead, he was afraid of what others might think of him if he fled. As he says, "...I couldn't risk the embarrassment...Traitor! they yelled. Turncoat!...Embarrassment, that's all it was (O'Brien, 59)." O'Brien didn't want to make a decision that went against society's expectations, and that to him was cowardice at its fullest. He enlisted, and forever regretted it.

[Lorin M]

I agree with Monique in her reply and also with O'Brien in his quote. I think that O'Brien has endured an incredible amount throughout the novel and also that he has learned quite a lot about courage and how it is measured. I agree with his theory that courage is something that can be gained and used. It is something that can be stored and spent, and this is also what makes it so important. If a man goes his whole life being a coward, then he can never be capable of doing something brave, because he doesn't know any better. In contrast, if a man is courageous his whole life, then he is capable of overcoming any situation, no matter how intimidating or frightening.

[William P]

2. I feel that the 21-year-old O'Brien's theory of courage is more of an act of redemption than an act of lion-hearted courage. In my opinion, by not acting on what you think is right leaves you with a stomach full of shame. This feeling demands to be combated with an act of courage. His theory of courage is not an interest-building quality, but a reaction to other emotions. I also believe that the 43-year-old O'Biren would view courage as an impulsive action, such as the decisions that he and others made in Vietnam.

[Savannah B]

I disagree with Will's point of view on O'Brien's courage. In "On The Rainy River" O'Brien clearly states at the end of the chapter that his leave to war shouldn't be seen as an act of courage to anyone; "I survived, but it's not a happy ending. I was a coward. I went to war" (O'Brien, 61). Therefore we can predict that he does not feel his other acts in war were courageous. It seems obvious why 21 year old O'Brien would believe in the idea of finite courage. This theory gave him affirmation and comfort in the choices he made. I think 43 year old O'Brien would have a completely different point of view. After witnessing and experiencing true courage out in the combat zone, O'Brien would most likely think courage is infinite. Instead of building up to be used up, courage grows upon itself from experience. In O'Brien's stories he often writes about what he wished he had done or was afraid of doing, which supports my theory that O'Brien would believe in infinate courage.